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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 1:39 am 
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So you spend all that money on child labor to hurl soft balls at windows . . .

And then you do this? :shock:

Florida may gut discounts for hurricane shutters
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/southflorida/story/1178070.html


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 6:48 am 
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Sounds like a way to make the wealthy pay for windowcare for all. :wink:


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 10:58 am 
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Sigh.... Tallahassee is making my job harder.

As Larry Gispert - Hillsborough County's Emergency Management Director - says, all we need is a good category two storm to make landfall to shake these morons in Tallahassee up a bit...

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:54 pm 
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This is being done by a company that has already announced that they are leaving the Florida market so they are just maximizing their profits before they leave.

We have shutters on our house and can get a discount from our insurer - the state of Florida. The sad part is that our shutters are considered an "improvement" to our house so we have to pay property taxes on them each year. After we put our shutters on the house, they passed a law that says you no longer have to pay taxes on them but it was NOT retroactive :mad: .


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:44 am 
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PK wrote:
This is being done by a company that has already announced that they are leaving the Florida market so they are just maximizing their profits before they leave.

We have shutters on our house and can get a discount from our insurer - the state of Florida. The sad part is that our shutters are considered an "improvement" to our house so we have to pay property taxes on them each year. After we put our shutters on the house, they passed a law that says you no longer have to pay taxes on them but it was NOT retroactive :mad: .


That is a real stinker PK!! They should be consistent. Either it is or it isn't. Since so much government money goes to cleaning up after storms, it seems like the government should give you a break. :(


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:57 am 
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You'd figure, right?

Alas, the budget issues have made everyone a little crazy in the head...

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:00 pm 
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Tampa Tom wrote:
You'd figure, right?

Alas, the budget issues have made everyone a little crazy in the head...


Yeah, I'm expecting them to jack up the tax rate on property tax in Texas. Thank goodness I beat down my appraised value for 3 years.

I'm guessing property tax is significant in the Florida budget and the real estate market must be killing that.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 1:10 pm 
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Rockfish wrote:
Tampa Tom wrote:
You'd figure, right?

Alas, the budget issues have made everyone a little crazy in the head...


Yeah, I'm expecting them to jack up the tax rate on property tax in Texas. Thank goodness I beat down my appraised value for 3 years.

I'm guessing property tax is significant in the Florida budget and the real estate market must be killing that.


Truer words never written...

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 12:34 pm 
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Hurricane Rita 2005 South and Southwest Louisiana. In the weeks after the storm when people were trying to #1 either find their house or #2 find where it used to be or#3 try to get money to fix what they did have left , they got this zinger from some of the insurance companies here in the state.. They were not paying the flood insurance that people had paid money for. Because the 15 + feet of water that they had in their houses.. that was not a flood. the 2 storm surges that resulted in 15+ feet of water in some places was NOT considered a flood... So they paid out no money. And for the companies that DID pay out any monies to you, look out for your next bill, and that was IF you could afford the payment!!

Insurance companies that serviced other states RAISED their rates to those customers after they started paying out monies to customers here in Louisiana.

Profits... its all about profits.......

And then all of the insurance companies except one, and that is a state supported company here in Louisiana, stopped writing insurance policies completely. It is only w/in the last year, 2005 - 2008 that SOME companies started writing policies again.


Insurance companies are entirely TOO BIG, TOO RICH, AND HAVE ALTOGETHER TOO MUCH POWER. They are just one more institution in this country that needs a major overhaul......


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 2:15 pm 
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B3, disagree. Insurance companies are REGULATED businesses. The folks who build below sea level or in flood plains have their claims paid by premiums from those who don't. It's a risk pool. Problem with the whole thing is that politicians and regulators want to keep their own folks' costs low, so they won't allow the rates to cover the risk and rising costs.

Lucky rural folks like myself get to pay the same auto/property theft rates as those who live in Detroit or other cities in Michigan, even if we live where we regularly leave the keys in the car. Keeps their rates lower, and there's more of 'em, so more votes. We also pay into a pool to cover uninsured and underinsured motorist claims in a no-fault state. Then there are the "essential phone service" taxes you pay every month on your phone so those who don't pay can have one ... goes on and on.

Even works like that with health insurance. Our ambulance bills X amount per run/mile. BCBS gets a discount, Medicare pays less than they do, medicaid almost nothing. Love the private insurers, especially for auto accidents. They pay full rate. Or, in reality, they subsidize the others, who don't even meet the cost of providing the service.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 2:31 pm 
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Where TT and I live on the Florida coast, no insurance company other than the state will cover us. Our house was built in 1948 and is still standing. It's 39' above sea level and has full hurricane shutters. Still, the insurance companies say no at any price. To give you an idea of rates down here, we pay about 2% of the value of the house per year for coverage and that's with a $6000 hurricane deductible. Don't even ask what boat insurance costs :shock: .


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:08 pm 
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The funny little deal with insurance is also that the large carriers (who really no longer write policies in Florida) set up 'Florida operations' technically independent of the parent companies right after Hurricane Andrew.

So, while say Allstate paid out claims in 1992 for Andrew, only Allstate's 'Florida operation' had to pay out in 2004 for Charley. The risk for Allstate was just spread over Florida, not over the entire country. Thus, these companies which haven't had a new hurricane claim to pay since Wilma hit in 2005 are boosting the rate unabashedly at 35% a year or bumping out of Florida altogether.

Now, in something like 38 of the 50 states, if you write auto policies, you have to also write homeowners policies. Alas, Florida is not one.

Oh, Florida's the only state with Billion Dollar disasters? Hurricanes are the only disasters that get paid out across this fair land?

No way...

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/img/reports/bi ... on2008.pdf

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:14 pm 
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Profits aren't the enemy. Lack of competition is the enemy.

I've spent the last 10 years in an industry that has to cut prices at 20% a year to remain competitive. The only time I've seen prices stabilize is when there have been supply shortages. As soon as supply increased, the price fall continued.

From what I can tell, there is a lack of supply of insurers in coastal areas because government regulations have made it unprofitable to operate there. Hence, prices are high.

I'm really happy with my insurers:
- Auto - they just reduced my rates and sent me a rebate check
- House - reasonably priced
- Umbrella - $1M in coverage for $150 / year
- Health (yes, I buy my own) - $91 / mo


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:18 pm 
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And, that lack of competition is exactly what's causing our problems here in Florida. By not requiring companies to write the homeowner's policies when they sell auto policies (Auto policies, from what I have been told, are like gold mines to insurance companies), they can pick what they want to sell.

By requiring the companies to sit at the table and negotiate, they can spread the risk throughout the entire country and not penalize just good old Florida.

I thought this map tells the story.. so, are you telling me that no one in the southeast should have homeowner's coverage?

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/img/reports/bi ... te2008.pdf

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 3:47 pm 
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I remember the insurers pulling out of coastal areas. Can't remember the all of the details, but yes, I remember after Andrew it got really hard to insure your house.

That really stinks! Back to the original post, I also think it stinks that you get no benefit - and actually get penalized for adding hurricane shutters.

On profits . . . Nokia, who is one of the most successful companies in the world, has a very interesting perspective on the profitability of their suppliers. If you want to be a supplier to Nokia, you must prove that you can be profitable. (They inspect your books and cost models). They do coach their suppliers on strategies to improve profits. However, if you are currently a Nokia supplier and show that you can not sustain profitability, they will drop you. Since Nokia makes 1 million phones each and every day, the creativity of their suppliers goes into hyper-drive to find innovative ways to take out cost so they can have a portion of that business.

One thing people forget is officers of public companies have the legal responsibility to maximize profits. Even if it made sense for them to run an unprofitable business, they are still bound by their legal responsibility

TT & PK, I sincerely hope FL sets up an environment for companies to provide home insurance in a profitable way. Competition does good things!


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:03 pm 
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Hey TT, that's a lot of B's on your map there. WOW!!

Have to say I'm a little surprised by the results.


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